Otstavil - Put Aside

[emmanuelg]

10 June 2024 - Dream - Otstavil

 

I went to bed saying “I will dream a dream of the future.”

When I woke up this morning– Or rather, what woke me up this morning, was an image of a man standing in an upside-down quincunx (probability curve). He is facing left, and underneath this picture is a single word in Russian, “otstavil.” Here is the picture I drew after awaking;

 

I could not remember what the word meant. Google translate definition is “[He was/It was] put aside. It is masculine, past tense.

 

Я отставил is translated as “I put it aside” by Google Translate--

 

But when I ask Google Translate to translate “I put it aside” into Russian, I get:

 

Я отложил это в сторону which means something more like “I postponed it.”

 

“I left it there” is translated “Я оставил это там”– only one letter different.

 

I suspect Google translate has gotten this one slightly wrong–or my dream spelling is not great.

 

Отставил [infinitive Отставить] is related to the word ставить, meaning ‘to place upright.’

 

What does it mean?

 

Hmmm, I dunno. The upside-down probability curve may mean, “you think it’s improbable, but it’s not.” I have some minor concerns about losing my job. I think this is very unlikely, but perhaps I should take a closer look at these concerns.

 

On the other hand, why is the caption a Russian word that I don’t understand well, with a subtle meaning that eludes my dictionaries?

I feel it has something to do with the war in Ukraine.

In Ukranian, the word simply translates as ‘left,’ in the sense of something you discarded.

 

This is very mysterious. Probably will mean something to me someday, but just now I don’t have a clue.

Comments

[methylethyl]

Don't you love it when your dreams try to message you in a language you don't know?

I had one where someone I used to know (since deceased) was offering me a large book. I was reluctant to take it-- something felt wrong about it. So I demurred and walked away. The book had a Greek word inked onto the page-edges, the way we used to deface our school textbooks with ballpoint pens. The word was "Kakos".

I looked it up after I woke, because it felt so sinister.

κακός = vile, evil, bad...

Still trying to figure out why the dead would want to give me an evil book, but I'm glad I didn't take it!

[emmanuelg]

Yes, that is very strange. I think it sometimes happens this way if the foreign language expresses the message better than what could be said in English. Now, exactly WHAT message we are talking about is something I am continuing to ponder...

[sinners4diseasecontrol]

How fascinating, Emmanuel! Yes, it seems deeply significant, but cryptic. I ran a Yandex translation of otstavit' and got a bunch of interesting examples of its use in literature: "You must put aside these personal connections and render an impartial verdict" "He put his gun aside." "Stand down, Morgan." "Dismissed..." "Hold on..." "Negative, lieutenant." "Belay that order."

Possibly, Russia is experiencing difficulties that it has managed to hide well, and will need to set some of its efforts aside. The picture also looks a bit like "duck and cover" so "Stand down, Morgan" and "Belay that order." could be very important to us all.

Left facing: If you tell someone to draw an animal, chances are it will be left-facing, but if you tell them to draw a person, it will be face on. Regardless of what the Western media calls Putin, he is economically liberal, and initially favored integration with the West, as long as the Russian people were not given a bum deal. So possibly this represents him. Where he is standing--he is a very principled man and tends to isolate himself from people around him who might try to influence him emotionally. This has got to be a particularly hard time for him.

Soooo, I think I will update my Sunday prayer, asking the Divine to bless Putin and help him get "Morgan" to stand down. There's no way for me to get his permission for such, but everything hangs in the balance for the rest of us.

Of course, this was your dream, and my interpretation would not be as good as yours. At best, by presenting a flawed interpretation, I might help you determine the correct one.

Dying (hope not literally) to hear what you think.

Pat Ormsby

[emmanuelg]

Hi Pat,
I think the Sunday prayers for Putin are a good idea. It may be a much more dangerous time in that conflict than most of us realize. I hear a lot of pundit opinions on news reports about 'Putin is probably bluffing about use of battlefield nuclear weapons' and 'if US weapons are used on Russia, probably a gesture at most in return', but the upside-down probability curve may mean that the assessments of what Putin will or will not 'probably' do are incorrect. Putin may take actions that catch the West unprepared.
In the big picture, Russia and Ukraine have had declining birth rates for years, and killing off large numbers of eligible bachelors may threaten their long-term cultural survival.

'Otstavil' is a very mysterious caption. I have been studying Russian with the Pimsleur Language program for several years, as I have a feeling that there will be refugees in my part of Canada who speak Russian and who may need medical help. I am slowly getting a feel for it, at least sometimes.

'Otstavil' is a verb in the past tense, past perfect I believe. Something that was done once and is not ongoing. It is also masculine. A man would say "Yah otstavil," while a woman would say "Yah otstavila" to say the same thing about themselves. "Ot" is a prefix that means 'from' at least some of the time--and can be a separate word at times.

Looking at the picture I drew when I woke up that day, it looks like I actually wrote 'ot stavil'-- Two words. What they might mean changes, depending on the context in which they appear.
'Yah ot stavil' (Yah = I, first person pronoun) means "I left it."
But change the "I" to a "He" -- 'On ot stavil' means "He put it away."
Change it to "they" -- 'Oni ot stavil' comes up as "They didn't put it" in Google translate.
If I add the word for "there" (tam), 'Oni tam ot stavil' comes out as "They put it there."

Add a negative 'ne', and 'Yah ne ot stavil' becomes "I didn't put it down."

The infinitive 'stavit-' means 'to put something upright in a particular place.'

Taking a step back from all that, if it is Putin, he may be thinking about making an announcement along the lines of "I have restored everything in Ukraine to its proper state," and calling the whole thing off.
This seems very unlikely, but he IS standing in an upside down probability curve....

[sinners4diseasecontrol]

Thank you for this analysis, Emmanuel! Your own insights into the meaning have the most meaning.

Actually, I have taught Russian. That is not a huge brag. I can get my students an overview of the grammar, a slightly flawed version of the phonetics, a mob of useful expressions and the confidence to use their knowledge to speak to native Russian speakers, from whence they can make greater progress. I'm in the middle of Bulgakov, looking up each and every word I don't immediately know, noting the stress, etc., and began corresponding with a Russian scientist recently as part of my EMR activism.
I think it is possible, if we look back far enough in the evolution of the Russian language, that the prefix "ot-" would have been considered separate from the verb, as it is with nouns. It would be possible even now to say "ot stavit'" with the infinitive acting as a noun, meaning "moving away from" or "starting from" positioning something. My far from native impression is that would be possible but awkward. With the past tense "stavil" it would be ungrammatical.
So what we have here would be a man (presumably Vladimir Vladimirovich) saying "I put it aside" or that a man put it aside or stood down. I've heard "otstav'/otstav'te" used to mean "Quit it!" (Yandex says "Leave it alone!" but also meaning "Leave me alone!" https://translate.yandex.com/?source_lang=ru&target_lang=en&text=%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%B2%D1%8C
As you have been studying Russian, it's likely you've seen the word and it stuck in your subconscious. That's actually an important part of the process of learning a language. Your mind treats it like a puzzle.

It would be useful to ask one of the native Russians like Daniil Adamov on Ecosophia what they make of it. I think the mystery will remain whether Putin will decide to stand down or persuade "Morgan" to. My bet is on Morgan, because he has less to lose from it, and Putin has never been a quitter.

But we'll see.

[emmanuelg]

Hopefully, the people who live there will find a way to do the right thing for all the people who live there. That's my prayer for them anyway!

[sinners4diseasecontrol]

I just added this to my Sunday prayer: Grant Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin the strength and courage to persuade people who may be emotionally distraught to stand down from a nuclear confrontation.

I like your prayer very much too. Thank you for sharing your dream!

[temporaryreality]

Or the dreamworld is telling you it’s put aside your request for a foretelling dream for now?

[emmanuelg]

That could be. If nothing else, it's been an interesting meditation. :-)